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Bernz Says, in 9-23-2007 at 08:41:51 from 66.8.136.100    

F***!shogun lost but im not as upset as i thought i would be.shogun’s still adapting to the new rules and fundamentals of the cage.im sure he’ll learn,evolve,and continue his rule from here on.i personally think he needs to work on his boxing and be alot more aware on the ground.

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beeman Says, in 9-23-2007 at 09:04:15 from 71.233.11.142    

thanks for posting the results im glad i didnt drop 40 dollars to watch that very happy for forrest but really disapointed about liddell !!!!!!!!! thanks again

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Jorge Says, in 9-23-2007 at 11:43:09 from 69.238.73.244    

Bull s*** this fight was fixed. Did you see how tame Shogun was. Very unlike himself and gased out in the third round????come on give me a brake! have you seen him fight in pride for three rounds straight without droping a sweat which equals to a first 10 min and then two 5min rounds and then all of the sudden his tired and very gentle fighting on his first fight on UFC. This is really fishy! I wonder how much he got paid to lose? either way he probably has to do whatever Dana says since UFC is now the owner of Pride.

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klez v50 Says, in 9-23-2007 at 13:47:53 from 89.240.244.144    

jorge yeahhhh whatever u can say its bullshit cause your shogun got his asskicked. anyway what an excuse

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kappian Says, in 9-23-2007 at 15:35:43 from 70.171.180.192    

Dissapointed by the performance of shogun…he is a great fighter…may be cage tactics and ufc rules played a part there…i am sure if this fight happened in pride shogun would have won

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IKNOW Says, in 9-23-2007 at 17:02:55 from 65.208.12.70    

NO EXCUSES ON THE RULES OR THE CAGE. PRIDE FIGHTERS ARE OVERRATED EXCEPT RAMPAGE. OVERSEA FIGHTERS DON’T HAVE THE FACILITIES OR THE TEAMS TO MAKE THEM BETTER.

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Bosancina Says, in 9-23-2007 at 21:45:59 from 24.64.223.204    

This is not about teams, rules, organizations or setting it’s about the preperation (physical and mental). Cro Cop deserved what he got, first never willing to train in an octagon and properly applying his technique to the new rules. Hendo… well Rampage is just better and feels more at home at the moment. Nog well can’t say yet the nerves must have got him, but I have faith he’ll be ok. Mauricio like Cro Cop got what he deserved. I don’t think he used roids in PRIDE or that the fight was fixed. In the past year he hasn’t fought top guys, dislocated his elbow, and has been showered with pride as the top LHW in the world. He obviously didn’t train enough and properly for the fight, but I’m not worried he’s very young still (25) and has plenty of skill. I like Forest and all the best to him in the future.

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niv Says, in 9-23-2007 at 23:43:32 from 66.183.30.166    

I agree this Shogun is not the same guy that fought in Pride. Having said that I don’t believe the fight was fixed, if anything maybe Shogun started to believe his own press, or his recent wedding may have taken his eye off the ball.

As for the Pride fighters being overrated, that’s bullshit! You obviously disregarded the fact that UFC fighters attended Pride tournaments and got their asses handed to them in the past. ie: Lidell and Belfort, neither guy is a slouch. Don’t forget Anderson Silva and Quinton are both Pride fighters.

It’s a shame Wanderlei Silva and Lidell didn’t happen a few years ago when both guys were at their peak, but I think it’ll be a great fight regardless.

What has been proven with this merger is that the best is yet to come. It’s obvious some guys have adjusted to the rules quicker than others, and the tactics that come into play in the octagon. If the Pride guys are still losing after 3 or 4 fights I’ll say UFC had the better guys. At this point I can’t agree, with that assessment.

Personally from what I’ve seen in the past, I’ll be surprised if Shogun doesn’t come back and win the title later next year. As for Forrset, awesome stuff he deserves a shot at Quinton. I wish him luck, but I don’t think he’ll beat him.

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niv Says, in 9-23-2007 at 23:50:50 from 66.183.30.166    

Sorry I didn’t think of this on my previous post, if Dana ever signs Fedor, the ex Pride guys are going to look a whole hell of a lot tougher.

What I really would like to see is a tournament that goes over a few months span that starts in the octagon under UFC rules, and then have the same fighters fight in Japan under Pride rules. That may be a much better assessment of where everyone stands right now.

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JIN Says, in 9-24-2007 at 04:11:40 from 58.69.3.138    

I hope UFC can have a event like PRIDEFC in the ring im sure a lot of fans would like to see.

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Jay Cee Says, in 9-24-2007 at 11:24:57 from 66.67.218.221    

Even though I wanted Forrest to win, I have to admit, I was disappointed with Shogun’s performance. I was amazed that he tired out so fast, especially when he’s used to fighting 10 minute first rounds. However, I don’t think anything was fixed or set up, nor do I think it had anything to do with new rules. Shogun probably just didn’t train as hard as he normally would have. Shogun has been rated number one and Forrest is a little underrated, so he probably didn’t think he’d have a hard time beating Forrest. Not only that, the man just got married three weeks before the fight. For all we know, his energy was being drained in the bedroom. Congratulations Forrest, but look out, I think Shogun will train hard to comeback with a vengeance!

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German_PI Says, in 9-24-2007 at 13:05:08 from 67.101.224.251    

Unbelievable! My hat goes off for Forrest Griffin. I thought Shogun Rua would win based on his prior fighting performance and solid record in “Pride.” However, I wouldn’t count Shogun as out of the game; Shogun is still a young man with a bright future. Nobody is invincible though. Congratulations Forrest!

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devilock Says, in 9-24-2007 at 13:30:58 from 66.223.56.123    

Shogun lost every aspect of that fight. He has been a favorite fighter of mine for the past few years. He didn’t exhibit any of the aggressive nature of his past fights. I don’t believe that the fight was fixed, I think Shogun may have just been looking past Forest. If you saw Wanderlei’s face as he watched the fight, you could tell that he was very worried.

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BaldBork Says, in 9-24-2007 at 15:51:38 from 70.167.217.19    

You guys need to drop the whole Pride v UFC thing. There are/were great fighters from both camps. We should all know that styles make fights. Be thankful that most of the pride guys have come over. Too bad Fedor bailed and went elsewhere.

IMO the better strikers were in the UFC and better BJJ in Pride. Put them together and I think you are seeing the best of both worlds.

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FIN Says, in 9-26-2007 at 20:05:52 from 161.184.181.189    

Wrt Jorge’s comment, I’m kind of relieved to see that someone else notices the obvious, sad truth: certain UFC fights are clearly fixed in favor of the most marketable guys. I’m honestly amazed that more people aren’t catching on.

Going into the bout between Griffin and Rua I didn’t really care one way or another who would win, so there’s no “sour grapes” here. I was just floored during the fight by how obvious it was that the outcome was predetermined.

Notice the weird pall in the building after the fight? The fans would have been going apeshit if they’d watched a genuine, stunning upset.

Notice Griffin’s discomfort, his “I’m not really that good” hyper-modesty after the right? Rogan had to remind him “you ARE that good, you just beat…” etc. Griffin wasn’t as genuinely happy as the — let’s face it, maybe fiftieth best fighter in the division in the world — should have been after beating Shogun. It was sad to watch.

I suggest that fans who are credulous about all outcomes should maybe clear their heads, take a deep breath, and sit down and — seriously, critically, calmly — watch Griffin vs. Ortiz, and try to make a case that Ortiz wasn’t told to not knock Griffin out. Seriously, try it.

The UFC acts as manager AND promoter. Last year they got almost $300 million in PPVs — far outstripping the best year of ALL boxing matches and organizations and production companies combined. And then there’s the merch…

The most marketable fighters — Griffin, Couture — and not necessarily the best fighters are the foundation of that mega-million$ juggernaut. And it’s significant that a lot of the ignorant fans — just listen to how the crowd starts to boo these days when someone isn’t getting their face smashed in — are coming from pro wrestling. Hmmm.

Jorge: You’re not the only one who sees it, bro.

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pamking Says, in 9-26-2007 at 23:37:06 from 24.221.223.143    

Wow. Some of you people need to quit confusing MMA with the WWE.

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langren Says, in 9-27-2007 at 13:20:53 from 206.255.60.104    

“FIN” has some very solid points.The UFC is a business.It’s job is to make money.In order to do that they need personalities.Forrest Griffen is a face that people can get behind.If you look at the big picture it isn’t difficult to predict what will happen in the coming year.1-Jardine Beat Griffen.2-Griffen beat Shogun,Jardine beat Liddell(on the same card).3-Now that both are in title contention they will have a rematch to see who fights for the title.(Griffen will win)4-Griffen will fight Rampage,and in a display of true heart will overcome adversity in order to triumph and gain the title.5-Cue dumb Americans going apeshit,viewership increases,profits increase,Parent Corporation,Zuffa is happy.
I’m not sure why this concept is so difficult for some of you to understand.It has been going on in major sports for eons.Whenever there is money to be made,there will be fixed fights/games.Get your heads out of your asses people and wake up.Oh,and by the way,I am a professional MMA fighter.

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dangermatt Says, in 9-27-2007 at 15:16:40 from 12.37.244.92    

The Griffin fight was fixed? If the UFC were going to fix the fight is that what they would want? Are they happy with this result? HELL NO! Ridiculous! Rua was brought in as Pride’s best with the hope for big win followed up by a big showdown with either Rampage or Chuck or Silva on down the line. That’s what they were hoping for. That’s what they would “fix” if they could.

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langren Says, in 9-28-2007 at 00:43:30 from 206.255.48.88    

Yeah,that makes sense.I’m sure they wanted a non-english speaking Brazilian to be their poster boy for an all American audience.Much better than a charismatic hometown underdog.

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Jorge Says, in 9-28-2007 at 03:28:06 from 69.238.73.244    

Did I mentioned that it only took Shogun less than 4 min to beat the crap out of rampage, so bad rampage couldn’t even move after they stoped the fight? Do you really still thinking that UFC is real?

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HOPA Says, in 9-28-2007 at 07:50:23 from 62.183.182.124    

I honestly don´t think that Shogun is a profitable fighter for Zuffa. Trying to build a big showdown between him and say, Silva would require terrible amounts of marketing as US fans are not familiar with them. And on the other hand 2 foreign fighters could never draw as much attention as for example a dull XXth rematch between Tito and Ken.. Griffin on the other hand is a well known american fighter around whom big showdowns can be easily built. You just need to “let him have” one more win to pit him against Quinton. Outcome of that match doesnt matter actually as both are american and both draw audience. Shogun or Silva on the other hand are way too foreign to hold belts at this point. Propably after a year if they perform well and crowd learns to know them and which is more important starts to like em,they can be used in title fights.
Thus, I gotta agree with FIN and Jorge. You, dangermatt seem a dedicated MMA fan as for you the fights you mentioned are important, but I doubt they are that for Zuffa.

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EBD Says, in 9-28-2007 at 18:47:06 from 161.184.204.206    

There’s no doubt that the puckish, lovable, balls-out, beer-drinking middle-America underdog-warrior Griffin is far more marketable than Rua is, or that Randy Couture is a thousand times more marketable to middle America than Gonzaga ever could be.

The popular-hero narrative — “they said he was too old” or “he’s gangly, slow, unskilled and doesn’t have a punch, yet he wins with his heart and character” — that earns Zuffa it’s millions would crash and burn if the UFC simply tried to find out who the best fighters in the world are. The best fighter might well be an ugly, uncooperative, non-English-speaking wife-beater who lives, crime-connected, in Brazil — try selling merch in Nebraska with that — and you’d see the likes of a Matt Lindgren, say, comprehensively ass-whipping — probably in a “boring” fight — a lot of the UFC’s commercial stars — the Griffins, the Jardines and the Bonners.

It’s instructive to compare two fights: Jackson vs. Henderson, and Griffin vs. Bonner. Jackson vs. Henderson was a world-class fight, fought at the highest, deadly-competent level of skill. The fans — unbelievably — booed, and the announcers seemed concerned about the lack of “action.” Whereas when the famous and personable Griffin took on the personable and famous Bonner, in a fight that was — in relative terms — like watching a couple of 65 year-old drunks fighting over a woman, the fans were on their feet going nuts, and afterwards Dana White, who knighted the occasion as a breakthrough moment for the UFC, couldn’t stop grinning; he kept saying like he couldn’t say it strongly or often enough that it was “the best f****** fight in the history of the UFC.”

Which fight would Zuffa prefer?

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Jorge Says, in 9-29-2007 at 00:15:13 from 71.128.68.10    

Shogun lost against Forest, now the next fixed fight would be Emelianenko losing against whoever thechampion is in UFC. Should we call it now WWFC?

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Niv Says, in 9-29-2007 at 01:15:07 from 149.99.245.146    

OK for the guys who believe this fight was fixed, I stated I didn’t think it was, but I definitely am well aware of what you are saying.

When you have one organization acting as promoter and manager you are asking for trouble. The Bisping Hamill fight was clearly bullshit, and I think that decision was a hometown decision. On the Rua fight I see all of the concerns, and I still can’t believe this was the same guy that utterly destroyed all the competition (including Quinton)winning the 2005 Pride Grand Prix. But, I think and this is more wishfull thinking than logic, the UFC would be extremely stupid to take chances this big at having this sport killed just as it’s taking off.

Let’s face it, if they’re fixing fights and telling their fighters to go out and fight a lame fight, they will eventually get caught and it will cost them everything. It took decades but boxing has almost completely died. This is a result of people knowing that what they’re getting may not always be what it seems.

UFC, if you’re reading any of these posts and any of this is true, please don’t be stupid; this sport will sell itself to knowledgeable fans and it will continue to grow. Don’t jeapordize this thing, it has so much potential and you’re seeing it.

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randall Says, in 10-1-2007 at 17:12:51 from 71.217.230.15    

Well, I’m liking allot of what I’m hearing here. The understanding that Rua was clearly not himself on most of the posts here shows me that most of you peeps have watched more than one of Shoguns previous bouts.
Mauricio “Shogun” Rua was terribly marketed here in the states leading up to this fight, the night of the 22nd of september. Everything about Shogun from the premotion of 76 pre fight, was cold and without any attempt at showing Mauricio’s humanity, just that he was a vicious animal in the ring from a far off place who couldn’t speek english. Here’s the thing, I don’t mind that(even though any avid follower of mma knows Rua to be quite the contrary, aside from of course the speaking english part) because I don’t feel I have to know I could get along with a guy to be able to appreciate his skills in the cage/ring, but this is where the true animal sinks his teeth in with a ferocious snarl, you know what I’m talking about,the worshipers of “THE ALMIGHTY COIN”. The big wigs at the UFC knew they had a pre- packaged product in Griffin with his underdog story that was relayed to a built in audience he attained through the silly “THE ULTIMATE FIGHTER” show and simply used Rua to further push their product in an amazing display of deft by the UFC marketing dept. Anyhow that was just a side note, oh! Wait a minute!!! I forgot to mention how they(THE UFC’S MONEY HUNGRY EXEC’S) gave Griffin the All Access, like anybody needs more info on a guy who came into being via the television!!! He’s a f****** “REALITY” T.V. star for f**** sake!!!! But seriously I’m moving on to what’s acctually important. No thanks to the f****** UFC’s heartless corperate suite’s this might be the first time you’ve heard this, so time to start explaining what actually happened with Shogun in UFC76 Knockout…… lol! Well, about a month before the fight Rua f***** his knee up while training, so vast amounts of cardio conditioning were clearly skipped to avoid another injury.
He simply trained around the problem apparently feeling confident in the cardio/endurance department. Now I don’t know if I BELIEVE that’s the reason he followed through with making the 22nd his debut, but it’s what he’s saying or at least his camp team chute boxe is saying(GOOGLE IT BITCH) but the lack of training and his injured knee IS the reason for his calm approach and gassing half way into the second round, not because of Griffin’s “skill” ha! Gimme a break! On top of that, factor in Rua’s recent wedding (2 weeks before the fight)and sudden brush with fame in the states (Adrianna Lima, Vanity Fair cover, photo shoot) and you’ve got a whole new picture painted before your eyes. Don’t get me wrong I know in the end it was Shogun’s move not to reschedule therefore Shogun’s mistake that resulted in Shogun’s defeat at the hands of the soon to be 205lb gate keeper and with the moniker of “THE GUY WHO BEAT SHOGUN ONCE.” Shogun beat himself had he a bit more energy he could have stopped Griffin 1st round tko, and based off how well Shogun did undertrained and injured you’d be a fool to disagree.

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dudewithface Says, in 10-10-2007 at 03:08:57 from 68.145.84.45    

im pretty sure theyre not acting when they fight but ufc does try and pair them up with people to try and get a win with the popular people
liddell vs jardine – jardine sucks they expected liddell to win and get every 1 to like him again, lol they probably would have gave him the win if it wernt for the matt and bisping fight then every 1 would think its really fixed
cro cop vs kongo – they gave him someone that would stand up and fight him hoping he could win and have the fight every 1 wants cro cop vs randy
i really dont think theyre fakeing it but i do think ufc is playing with the matches to get the outcome they want

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Mark Says, in 10-15-2007 at 04:20:33 from 76.86.159.8    

Come on guys!!! The fight was obviously fixed. The exclamation point to the fix was the fact that Shogun taps to a rear naked choke with less than a minute left in the fight. He wasn’t even sure if he was successful enough in his effort trying to lose the fight to convince the judges to give Forrest a decision so he tapped. I have seen Shogun in 8 other mma matches, which I have on DVDs. He just does not give up his back to anybody like that unless of course he is baiting them. Come on Dana, what kind of s*** are you trying to pull. PLEASE!! DON’T F*** THIS SPORT UP WITH THIS KIND OF HORSE s***.

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Neil Says, in 11-24-2007 at 19:10:52 from 161.73.43.188    

All this talk about fighters not looking themselves is mildly humorous. Did anyone see the Gomi vs Diaz fight earlier this year? Gomi got whooped and submitted in a pretty impressive fashion by Nick Diaz of all people. Gomi didn’t look himself… I mean come on! Gomi like Rua gassed early on resulting in his loss of the fight. Period.
It makes me laugh that so many people so quickly conclude these fights are always fixed.
And in regards to Langren’s post:

“Yeah,that makes sense.I’m sure they wanted a non-english speaking Brazilian to be their poster boy for an all American audience.Much better than a charismatic hometown underdog.”

If this is the case then why the hell would the powers that be opt for the likes of Anderson Silva as Middle-weight champ? Like Rua, he requires a translator and is surely a less desirable fan for the home fans than 100% pure American Rich Franklin. Silva is simply a better all-round MMA fighter thats why he demolished Franklins ass twice. No ifs, buts or fixing. (Just to let you know with that said I am still a big fan of Franklin)

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hawkeye Says, in 12-14-2007 at 13:21:05 from 81.96.78.200    

Personnally I can’t believe the people who are saying these fights are fixed. Clearly Shogun had a bad night, get over it. Don’t you think one of the fighters would have said something by now about it being fixed. Can’t see Frank Shamrock keeping his mouth shut about something like that, or Ken for that matter. And if they were fixed then you got to put alot of blame on the fighters. Shogun could get millions working for anyone, and you reckon he gutless enough to get paid to lie down for Griffin for a payoff. Come on guys.

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Bill Says, in 1-1-2008 at 17:26:49 from 70.49.239.33    

The answer is always fixed when a persons favourite fighter gets beat. People lose fights, it happens, it is possible Shogun took Forrest lightly but that his fault, maybe Forrest has his number and is better than people think. The better fighter doesn’t always win. Its MMA! one punch could end it at any time, one mistake, a submission…

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